Four more years
Comments: 24
Dangerousmeta neatly and chillingly sums it up with help from Jefferson, Grant, Jackson, Roosevelt, Lincoln, et al.
The very best of luck to Americans everywhere, and may our gods help us all.
•••
Posted to Oh, the Humanity • 2005.01.21 (Fri) • 12:25
Comments
Posted by Adam Michela 2005.01.22, 01:49
No offense… but give it a rest already!
“Americans everywhere” voted him in. He is our president. Don’t like it? Move to Japan.
… oh … i forgot … :|
Posted by Alex 2005.01.22, 02:52
In regards to the above comment, only slightly more than half of Americans everywhere voted him in. I don’t want any false credit given to me for voting that man into office, because I did my very best to keep him out of it.
I’d also like to point out that both Australia and England have douche bags for leaders as well. John Howard re-elected this year…something is wrong the world-over, and it makes me sad.
Posted by jh 2005.01.22, 03:18
Adam —- Give it a rest!? Absolutely not.
Alex —- Ah, John Howard … the Little Man. Something is wrong the world over, you’re terribly right.
Posted by Adam Michela 2005.01.22, 04:30
So anyone you happen to disagree with or doesn’t support your world view is an douche bag? Interesting.
I don’t think you are you’re the sharpest pencil in the package but I wouldn’t go so far as to call you a douche bag.
:\
Posted by Feaverish 2005.01.22, 05:15
You know who should really have ‘given it a rest’? Those pesky Allies during World War II. I mean, Hitler was Germany’s leader! So the Jews were a little persecuted; who isn’t? Don’t like it? Move.
Thanks for the link, and please don’t give it a rest.
Posted by Adam Michela 2005.01.22, 07:13
You’re seriously comparing the fair and just election of a U.S. President to the rise of Adolf Hitler? You’re comparing … what … the war in Iraq? … to the slaughter of millions of Jews during WWII?
Wow.
That is ignorance beyond comparison. Grow up!
Posted by Jeff 2005.01.22, 08:08
I attended the Inauguration (albeit in the cheap cheap seats) and the parade. Here’s my take (and photos) on what I experienced.
Posted by Narayan 2005.01.22, 11:55
Thanks for the well-wishes and the much-needed call for divine intervention, Jeremy. Sadly, the outcome of the last election has pushed even my boundaries of cynicism into something resembling nihilism.
Posted by Steve Ray 2005.01.22, 11:59
Uh, Adam, there was nothing fair or just about this election. Millions of African-Americans were not able to vote. I was incredulous when I heard that he called for the end of racism. He would not be where he is without it.
Posted by Winslow Oddfellow II 2005.01.22, 16:09
OH NOES!!1 4 more years, 4 more years — I can’t take it anymore!
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.23, 18:20
A link to an article about the millions of brothers and sisters that were disenfranchised this year por favor?
Posted by Pete Barr-Watson 2005.01.23, 22:48
maybe the world will start minding it’s own business when America does the fucking same. My limits have been reached by the actions of the US and the UK over the past two years - i make no apologies for having serious issues with America’s leaders and international policies. The fact that there are still US citizens telling people like us to ‘give it a rest’ shows just how out of touch with reality things are over there.
With all the reports of US intelligence teams acting beyond the law in Iran in recent months that came out this week I’d say the world really does need to pray to it’s gods.
And yes, the analogy of Bush vs Hitler is fairly apt I’d say - i think history will show that they are two of the world’s worst warmongers.
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.24, 06:50
Care to enlighten us on how they are “acting beyond the law in Iran? Which law? And does that same law apply to the terrorist groups that recieve direct funding from the Ayatollahs in Iran?
Posted by Pete Barr-Watson 2005.01.24, 08:06
which direct funding? Which Ayatollahs?
And, illegally entering a country with the sole purpose of gaining intel for possible future military action is against many, many laws both in the US and the majority of countries around the world.
“The Administration has been conducting secret reconnaissance missions inside Iran at least since last summer. Much of the focus is on the accumulation of intelligence and targeting information on Iranian nuclear, chemical, and missile sites, both declared and suspected. The goal is to identify and isolate three dozen, and perhaps more, such targets that could be destroyed by precision strikes and short-term commando raids.” - SEYMOUR M. HERSH, The New Yorker
see the whole article here: http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?050124fa_fact
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.24, 09:10
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/10/15/wmid15.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/10/15/ixworld.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A6581-2004Jun25.html (you may have to register)
Please tell us all the specific laws that were violated? Because if that was the case Pelosi, Boxer, and the rest of the leftists in Congress would have called for hearings already.
And who has come out to collaborate Seymour Hersh’s story thus far?
Posted by Khalid 2005.01.24, 09:31
Care to enlighten us on how they are “acting beyond the law in Iran?
There is also the huge matter of the Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty. Under the terms of the treaty, which the US has signed, it is obligated to take concrete steps towards the elimination of its nuclear arsenal in the foreseeable future. It has not only failed to live up to its legal obligations to do so, it has maintained its arsenal and begun research on new classes of nuclear weapons. Israel’s nuclear weapons are entirely overlooked by the US. This of course creates a huge need for other nations, especially Iran, to have them as well. We need a way to force the US to live up to its own legal obligations; that’s the first step towards reducing Iran’s need for them.
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.24, 10:08
No that is not at all the meaning of the NPT. Read up on it please:
http://www.fas.org/nuke/control/npt/
You seem to have confused it with some of the treaties we have signed and lived up to with the USSR/Russia.
Posted by Khalid 2005.01.24, 10:22
There is no confusion here; I work with some of the world’s experts in this area. This is not a bilateral treaty between the US and the USSR; it calls for “negotiations in good faith on effective measures relating to… general and complete disarmament.”
Article VI Each of the Parties to the Treaty undertakes to pursue negotiations in good faith on effective measures relating to cessation of the nuclear arms race at an early date and to nuclear disarmament, and on a treaty on general and complete disarmament under strict and effective international control.
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.24, 13:09
lol @ “experts”
Does that mean the IAEA and ElBaredi, if so that explains a lot.
Anways read this and tell me we are not taking concrete steps:
http://www.state.gov/t/np/rls/rm/24919.htm
http://www.fas.org/nuke/control/npt/news/art6chrn.htm
http://www.fas.org/nuke/control/npt/news/0425art6.htm
And do you honestlry think we would be wise to get rid of our nukes while China, Russia, Pakistan, and potentially Iran have them?
Posted by nancy 2005.01.24, 16:21
Alas, the above comments (most of them) are why I am suddenly a Canadian when I travel and live in Europe; the term “ugly American” isn’t new, but it’s gaining new depths. I was the first generation of my immediate family to be born in America, as versus Scotland or Canada — and lived overseas for most of my post-grad years. I think most Americans should be forced to live in another country for a minimum of 6 months. It would become a terrific Attitude Adjuster.
51% is a “majority” by only ONE percent. Some people failed math.
Facts won’t change the minds of the people who spout talking-points. Alas. Facts remain with those of us in the “reality-based minority.”
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.25, 09:26
Wow, I am suprised by the censorship practiced here :(
My post from yester never made it up.
Anyways allow me to try and duplicae it from memory and maybe it will show up this time.
lol @ “experts”
We have made concrete steps towards reducing our nuclear stockpiles:
http://www.state.gov/t/np/rls/rm/24919.htm
http://www.fas.org/nuke/control/npt/news/art6chrn.htm
But do you or anyone think that it will happen overnight? Is it in our best intrest to disarm while countries like China, Pakistan, North Korea, and Iran are building their stockpiles?
And Nancy, stay in Canada.
Posted by Khalid 2005.01.25, 11:30
Is it in our best intrest to disarm while countries like China, Pakistan, North Korea, and Iran are building their stockpiles?
Is it in Iran’s best interest to disarm while Israel and US, which routinely violate the sovereignty of other countries and occasionally invade them without legal cause, maintain their stockpiles?
Is it not hypocritical for the US to pressure Iran to live up to treaty obligations that go against their national interests, while the US itself violates treaty obligations because of its ‘national interests’? The whole point of the treaty is to make the world safer by creating mechanisms to make sure that no country uses the nuclear threat for purposes of ‘national interest’. Why bother having a treaty at all if any nation can abandon it at whim for reasons of ‘national interest’?
But do you or anyone think that it will happen overnight?
Not overnight, but the nuclear weapons states are legally and morally obligated to take the lead and move in that direction, as has been done with certain other kinds of weapons. Instead, the US is flagrantly violating that provision, and moving in the opposite direction. The US even insists that it may use nuclear weapons in a ‘first strike’ scenario, not simply as a defensive/retaliatory/deterrent measure.
The International Court of Justice, whose job is to interpret international law, has declared these uses illegal and has also explicitly stated, with reference to the NPT: “There exists an obligation to pursue in good faith and bring to a conclusion negotiations leading to nuclear disarmament in all its aspects under strict and effective international control”. http://www.icj-cij.org/icjwww/idecisions/isummaries/iunanaummary960708.htm
You can also find a ton of information here: http://www.douglasroche.ca/
lol @ “experts”
You can laugh at people with expertise, but frankly, it’s your ignorance which is laughable. Please continue reading and continue the debate with yourself.
Khalid
Posted by Jamal 2005.01.25, 12:36
Is it in Iran’s best interest to disarm while Israel and US, which routinely violate the sovereignty of other countries and occasionally invade them without legal cause, maintain their stockpiles?
Is it not hypocritical for the US to pressure Iran to live up to treaty obligations that go against their national interests, while the US itself violates treaty obligations because of its ‘national interests’? The whole point of the treaty is to make the world safer by creating mechanisms to make sure that no country uses the nuclear threat for purposes of ‘national interest’. Why bother having a treaty at all if any nation can abandon it at whim for reasons of ‘national interest’?
We are living up to our obligations, there is no time-frame that says we must get rid of our nuclear weapons by x date. Just tat we need to take steps to eventually get rid of nuclear weapons. Our stockpile is 1/3 of the cold war high and we have gotten rid of over 10,000 since 1990. That is what I would call living up to the agreement. Perhaps not as fast as you would like, but fast enough with all the rising threats.
And why am I not surprised that someone named Khalid would bring Israel into this. Well Israel never signed the NPT, Iran did. Israel has never used their WMD, Iran has.
Not overnight, but the nuclear weapons states are legally and morally obligated to take the lead and move in that direction, as has been done with certain other kinds of weapons. Instead, the US is flagrantly violating that provision, and moving in the opposite direction. The US even insists that it may use nuclear weapons in a ‘first strike’ scenario, not simply as a defensive/retaliatory/deterrent measure.
The International Court of Justice, whose job is to interpret international law, has declared these uses illegal and has also explicitly stated, with reference to the NPT: “There exists an obligation to pursue in good faith and bring to a conclusion negotiations leading to nuclear disarmament in all its aspects under strict and effective international control”.
As stated to you above, we have taken the lead.
Every country has contingency plans that include a first strike, even nuclear powers. If we knew that North Korea was going to launch a nuclear attack on us or our allies, then I would fully support a tactical first strike on a cave complex there. We have had nuclear weapons for 60 years and only used them once to end a World War. We didn’t nuke Pyongyang, Hanoi, Baghdad, etc… so I have confidence that we are not going to arbitrarily nuke third world countries, we are a little more responsible than that.
You can laugh at people with expertise, but frankly, it’s your ignorance which is laughable. Please continue reading and continue the debate with yourself.
What is even more laughable is how far you have your head up ElBaradei’s ass…
Posted by Durf 2005.01.26, 14:33
A: “I don’t like the president” B: “Give it a rest! Shut up!” A: “No, you shut up!” B: “Oh, censorship, is it?” C: “Nazis! Sort of!” D: “But … War on Terror!” B: “Damn straight!” A: “Sheer idiocy!” they are eaten by a bear
It’s impossible at this point to make any comment whatsoever on the American political process without having discussion plummet to these depths. I guess that’s what happens when there are no more high points in the process.
Post a comment:
Send This Story to an Enemy
• • •
